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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So my first post. Please forgive any guidelines I'm not following. I will try to be a better member in the future. Here goes.
Just bought this van 5 days ago. It was a buddies. He got it from a no great reputation car lot. 3.3 09 grand caravan, remote start, power doors all in the remote. This info may or may not be useful for diagnosis.
Wife was driving about 1 minute after leaving a gas station, maybe 30 seconds it died in the middle of the road. No CEL. Won't crank, only dummy light is a battery light. Headlights are bright, all windows and doors working. PRNDL is not working as I cannot shift out of gear unless I hit the release above the shifter to bypass the interlock solenoid. Push it out of the road. So I start racking my brain. " What would kill the car while driving and keep it from trying to start again. I could come up with nothing but possibly computer or ingition switch. So I research so to find out these vans commonly have issues with those things and the fuse box and the key. So great.
I go to a junkyard and get a new WIN module and key. Put it in, and it changes nothing. But works my doors and locks my doors much better. So figure it wasn't the problem but it is functioning in the van better than the other.
When I turn the key there is nothing but a couple relays in the Tipim or fusebox, and it also will not shift into gear. Check voltage to the battery 12.3. so figure that's not the issue.
I go to junkyard and get a computer for 40$. Put it in, no change everything identical to before. To rule out the battery I put in a different battery that I use every day in my truck. It changes nothing. Test voltage at the starter, no voltage. Even with the key turned to start. So I lift up my Tipim, I see a wire has been sloppily tapped from a connecter way back like 8 inches. It's a bare wire under there and the pin is loose and the connector has melted, right where it plugs in the area affected relay wise is the ASD relay. So bam I have found the problem right. Not exactly. Went to the junkyard found a nice plug, cut it off and replaced the burnt one with the nice one. Different battery, ignition, computer. Found a fuse popped that said it was related to the transmission and battery, 10 amp. Changed it. Hit the key, cranks over and starts runs for 2 seconds and shuts down. Start it again, same issue. This whole entire time the vehicle wouldn't communicate with the scanner. The reason I bought the WIN unit first was because that was a symptom of the win going bad. No comm w vehicle. And that continues until I am able to get it started and it dies. So I then try to communicate with my scanner again, it works. Says w never a check engine light shown that the EGR is a stored code, and a pending code. So pull it off and clean it well. Somehow now after it's clean and reinstalled, the van doesn't want to start again. Check the same fuse we changed before its not popped. Tried switching computers back to the stock one to see if it would start again and maybe stay running. Negative. No crank no start. The popped the same fuse as before. So swap the WIN back for the original. Thinking maybe the two stock peices needed to be together to communicate to the vehicle nothing was different. No luck just popped the same fuse. Swapped computer back to junkyard one. No crank. Put junkyard win back in. No crank. So that's where I'm at after 2 hard days of attempts at repair.
My only thought now is maybe Tipim although that it looks like it's fine isn't actually fine at all, or I have some more grounds I need to find and clean up and fix. The only grounds I have been able to find to clean were two time lil chassis grounds near the fusebox.
I'm so stuck at this point. I know my orig computer is popping that transmission fuse and that acted like it was the one thing when repaired let the van crank on its own key and run. It did this with both ignitions as well.

So computer seems to be bad because it popped fuses that kept the van from starting.
Battery was bad because when we tried to jump starter at the relay with a wire it barely rotated enough to make noise. So dead cell maybe? Different battery it would spin and spin. But had it cranking and running for two seconds at a time, everytime. Rescanned it finally communicate vehicle says EGR. Pull it off hoping that's what's not letting it stay running and now it won't crank again. Fuse hasn't popped. Just won't crank on the key again. Tried swapping relays, got a pocket full at the junkyard.

Tipim or grounds is all I can think of I haven't addressed, of the problems I know about. When it started it didn't struggle to start and once I was able to reach over and pat the gas once. Oil light did pop on when it dies every time. Oil sending unit then? So like 4 things went wrong at the same time.
 

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2013 Dodge Grand Caravan
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What fuse # keeps blowing?
 

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2013 Dodge Grand Caravan
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Do you know if you have the 4 speed or 6 speed transmission?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I sure don't know. For the 5 days we have owned it lol seems like the 1 time I drove it I didn't shift 5 times so my guess would be 4. Sorry no manual or anything came with it.
 

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2009 Dodge Grand Caravan SXT (3.8); 2003 Dodge Grand Caravan eL (3.8)
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The 5th generation vans with the 3.3l engine all came with the 4 speed.
 
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Seems the circuit is the same for both, just power to the PCM.

Unplug both of these connectors. Test for resistance against TIPM C2 pin 9 to PCM C1 pins 10 and 29. It should be near 0 ohms, but up to 5 is considered acceptable. Also check for a short to ground from any of these pins. Replace the fuse and plug back in only the TIPM side, then turn the key as if you were starting it. Did the fuse blow again?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
So my phone downloaded all the files you sent but says it can't open them. So I will check the locations of those wires in those connectors tomorrow. Been 100° the last two days. So I shut her down today. About ready to give up on our brand new van if things don't change soon. I'm not auto electric guru by any means. So it's starting to feel like it's over my head and that worries me. Because I can't afford anyone smarter than me. Lmao. Thanks very much for reaching out. I will try testing the resistance between those pins tomorrow and let you know what I find.
 

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Get a PDF reader app and you should be able to open them. They are wiring diagrams and pinouts. It'll make it a bit easier to find the right pin. Wiring diagram for the circuit isn't super important, but the pinout can be very helpful.

The PCM connector is black with a black pin socket. TIPM connector is a 26 pin with only about half of them used. The wire you want to test is solid red in all 3 locations.

Actually, you can do the last test I mentioned without any diagrams or meters, just pull the black on black PCM connector and see if attempting a start blows it. That would narrow the issue to wires and the TIPM for certain. Then pulling the TIPM 26 pin connector and trying with a new fuse would point at the TIPM being bad if it blows.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Ok pdf reader app. Gotcha. Will do when done with this. Is it a bad time to mention that I'm colorblind.....? ;) but my wife will be home and her eyes work fine. Lol. I thought for sure I fixed this whole deal when I found the melted plug and bare wire under loose electric tape in the same region of the Tipim that has the ASD relay, I think that lead to us ultimately being able to get it to crank on the key and run a couple seconds. Finally was able to use my scanner to talk to it. Tried to do live data but it didn't run long enough and it's a feature of my scanner I haven't gotten to explore. I'm just surprised the fuse isn't blown now and it still won't start. But thank you thank you thank you. I will be preforming those tests tomorrow.
So pulling the black on black pcm connector and trying to start it to see if it blows a fuse. Got it. Then pull Tipim 26 pin connector and trying to start it with a fresh fuse to see if it blows. If it does I probably need a new tipm. Right?
 

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If it blows without the TIPM connector on, yes. If it blows with just the PCM disconnected, it could be the wiring harness.

The occasionally allowing it to run for a second is rather confusing though. Also means it may take several start attempts for it to blow a fuse if it's going to, so you might get a "false okay" from a single attempt.

Colorblindness is definitely going to hamper you in electrical diagnosis, but those pinout diagrams will show you the pin location, so it will be less of an issue if you can read those.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Had a busy day yesterday so didn't get out to the van. Soon as I get motivated I'm gonna head out there and try my homework you gave me. Also gonna remove the battery tray to clean a couple grounds that are supposed to be under there. That fuse has only blown like 3 times in 2 9 hr days of messing with it. So I hope it blows like your thinking. So my WIN came out and 2010 w a 3.8 but it has started the vehicle. I have been seeing a lot with having to have it synced w your vin#. Is that true? How can it be if it's worked on my van?
 

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I've yet to deal with the key security of these vans, but I think the syncing prosses is just to turn the key and let it sit for a few minutes with it on, but not running. If that's the case, you probably did it without realizing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Ok so just got out to the van. Tried to start it, had the cables off and zip tied together. Tried to start, nothing. So now I'm gonna pull the black connector on the pcm and try to start several times and check the fuse to see if it pops. Here I go
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
So I notice that with the junkyard computer in I can put my foot on the brake and go thru the gears. Something I was not previously able to do. But I get curious so I put in old computer and try the same tests to try to pop the fuse. No luck. Try going thru the gears, no luck. Swap ignition real fast also no luck, starting or releasing gear shift. Swap back to junkyard computer, still stuck, swap back to junkyard ignition, still stuck. I am unable to replicate the same function or problem out of this vehicle twice. I'm so stuck right now.
 
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