[Mopar-Mofun]

Noticed the 4th gen postings have dropped significantly in the past year. Either all the owners are happy and worked the kinks out of them or they have moved to the 5th gen as forum section is just hopping with activity.

Here's a quick poll to see what your next plans are from owning this aged old vehicle.

 

[Sienile]

5th Generation Chrysler Minivans: 2008-2020

Discuss your fifth generation minivan here. (2008-2020 Dodge Grand Caravan, 2008-2016 Chrysler Town & Country) Get tips and technical assistance specific to your era of Chrysler Minivan

www.chryslerminivan.net

 

[Road Ripper]

The rust is consuming the 4th gens, so people are going newer. 5th gens are aging and their plethora of problems are making the 5th gen section busy. 3rd gens around me are almost gone, might see a 2nd gen once in a blue moon, and 1st gens are extinct.

 

[Ivan Caravan]

+ I like the looks of the 5th gens.

- I don’t like that there are no SWB 5th gen. Too big for my needs.

- I don’t like stow n go. I don’t like that you can’t take out the second/third row seats or put a 3 seat bench in the middle row and leave the third row for cargo with no stowed seat.

- I hate how hard it’s to figure out the trans fluid level with the 3.6 6-speed. Reading Jeepman’s posts over there it sounds like you have to have science degree to figure out if you have the right amount of ATF-4 in there due to varying trans temps.

- the Penstar tick tick would concern me.

So no, probably will not get a gen 5. If my 2006 shorty dies soon I will look for another low mileage 06 or 07 shorty. If my van dies in 10 years I may look for a 2016 or 2017 Mazda5 with a manual trans. Although I prefer 10 fold a gen 4 Chrysler SWB over a Mazda5 but in 10 years it will be super hard to get a good gen-4 due to age. Living with my gen-2 for over 20 years and my gen-4 coming on 4 years, I don't think I could live without having sliding doors. It will be very hard for me to move on from a Chrysler shorty. Hope my 06 keeps going for many years.

 

[multimopes]

I don't have a 4th gen but I LOVE my 3rd gen! Very similar to 4th gen, externally anyway! My brother has a 4th gen.

 

[atoman]

- I don’t like that there are no SWB 5th gen. Too big for my needs.

Corporate decided to replace it with Journey...

 

[FabricGATOR]

I'm waiting for Elon to produce a minivan, the model D

 

[Long_Voyager94]

The only real downside to the 5th gen over the 4th gen is perceived reliability due to the average owner. Under proper care, 5th gens have no issue going 3-4-500k+ miles, and they will do so pretty much trouble free.

They are smoother riding, better handling, more responsive, substantially quicker, and significantly more fuel efficient.

We have 4 of them in our family.

1 of them is over 550k miles.
2 of them are pushing 470k miles.
My 2018 is well over 100k.

Outside of a couple radiators, a couple suspension rebuilds, 1 oil cooler, they have been bulletproof reliable with just simple regular maintenance.
That of course means actually doing the oil changes at 4-5k intervals using only MS-6395 oil.
Actually changing the transmission fluid at proper 50k intervals, using only ATF+4.
Actually flushing the coolant and changing the thermostat at proper 80k intervals, using only a Mopar stat.
Actually changing the coils/plugs at 60k initially to get the subpar factory coils and garbage Champion plugs out.
Actually inspecting brakes, suspension, belts, hoses, etc and replacing when needed.

You know, all the things the average minivan buyer neglects.

 

[atoman]

They are smoother riding, better handling, more responsive, substantially quicker, and significantly more fuel efficient.

I respect your opinion, but don't agree with it (aside from significantly more fuel efficient above 65mph)
The ETC on 5th gen is not at all responsive if you compare it to our cable controlled throttle on 4th gen...
Handling and ride depend on model and suspension (and tires), the brakes are a big improvement on latter 5th gen with HD brakes.

 

[Long_Voyager94]

I respect your opinion, but don't agree with it (aside from significantly more fuel efficient above 65mph)
The ETC on 5th gen is not at all responsive if you compare it to our cable controlled throttle on 4th gen...
Handling and ride depend on model and suspension (and tires), the brakes are a big improvement on latter 5th gen with HD brakes.

The throttle has some lag if you baby it, if you drive it harder often, it adapts to driving style and it is perfectly responsive.

A base SE 5th gen rides and handles far better than the rolly nature of the 4th gens. A GT feels like a f$%#ing race car compared to the sloppy nature of 4th gens.

I know people like to wax poetic about the wonders of the 4th gen, but they were just as trouble some, had underpowered engines, and drive like wet noodles at best.

I'm sorry, but 3rd and 4th gens both drive like hot garbage from an actual enjoyment standpoint. The little bit of added response from the cable throttle is far negated by the pure lack of performance from the anemic 3.3/3.8s that powered most of them.

I have owned and dailied every generation of these vans.
1st gens started the light/tossable/fun minivan.
2nd gens (specifically the Sport models) were the last of the true "light/tossable/fun" minivans.
3rd and 4th gens bloated but failed to compensate for the bloat with better drivelines, suspension, brakes, so they ended up just feeling like obnoxious pigs on the road.
5th gens got completely revamped, better suspensions, better brakes (even the low models without HD are better than 4th gens) better engines, an updated transmission, better interiors, better noise suppression.
6th gens (Pacifica) take those improvements and refinements even further.

I personally won't touch 3rd/4th gens anymore because they just feel like such a chore to drive.

 

[Sienile]

Throttle response is fine stock, but can be a bit laggy at times. If it really bothers you, it can be easily resolved for about $40. Keeping your trans fluid fresh helps a good deal in this also.

 

[atoman]

Throttle response is fine stock, but can be a bit laggy at times. If it really bothers you, it can be easily resolved for about $40. Keeping your trans fluid fresh helps a good deal in this also.

LOL, really?:

Fitment:
For HYUNDAI
AZERA 2008-2019 ALL ENGINES
i40 2012-UP ALL ENGINES
ix25 2017-2019 ALL ENGINES
iX35/TUCSON (EL) 2010-2013 ALL ENGINES
iX35/TUCSON (EL) 2014-UP 1.6L 2.0L 1.7L
SANTA FE (CM) 2007-2009 ALL ENGINES
SANTA FE 2007-ALL ENGINES
Sonata gls 20132.4L
Sonata 20112.0T
VERACRUZ / ix55 2007-2013 3.0L 3.8L

For KIA
sportage 2012-2014 2.0L
Optima 2014 2.4L

Again JMHO, ETC is fine for 'soccermobile' / daily jalopy but nothing like cable... It's not just timing, it's accuracy (pedal position vs response) and resulting shift point 'float'.

 

[Sienile]

Shared the wrong link. Updated it, still under $45 and you can hunt for cheaper. Got mine for $35.

Changing the response can increase the accuracy too, but you should understand the main reason for ETC is the complexity of controlling a VVT engine. A VVT changeover is harder to manage efficiently without control of the throttle.

If you want more power, you need a tune and better intake at minimum. From there you can do even more tweaking to throttle response and accuracy.

 

[Baron]

don't care at all for the styling of the 5th gen, the pacifica was a massive improvement in the looks department, the only thing i like about the 5th gen is the 3.6's power

but it is true, the 4th and 3rd gen handle like 90s and early 2000s minivans, and i'm okay with that

 

[Road Ripper]

The 5th gen standard brakes are the EXACT SAME SIZE as the 4th gen brakes, in a heavier van! How on earth do you figure they're better?! That's why I LOL'd at the comment.

We had a 5th gen for a bit over a year, until it was paid off/totalled basically the same day. We loved the color (2011 deepwater blue) and it was sporty to drive, but was already having issues pop up one after another with 140,000 miles on it. It has design issues that can't be resolved and I'm glad we dodged all the mechanical issues that would have come up. We moved up to a Toyota Sienna and are happier with that. It has it's own share of problems, but nothing caused by engineering.

 

[atoman]

you should understand the main reason for ETC is the complexity of controlling a VVT engine

LOL, Good bull, even '08-10 3.8l exact same engines got ETC...\

If you want more power,

I'm fine with power of my '05 3.8l, even with overloaded van the precise control it has is plenty to overcome the lower HP...

 

[Long_Voyager94]

The 5th gen standard brakes are the EXACT SAME SIZE as the 4th gen brakes, in a heavier van! How on earth do you figure they're better?! That's why I LOL'd at the comment.

We had a 5th gen for a bit over a year, until it was paid off/totalled basically the same day. We loved the color (2011 deepwater blue) and it was sporty to drive, but was already having issues pop up one after another with 140,000 miles on it. It has design issues that can't be resolved and I'm glad we dodged all the mechanical issues that would have come up. We moved up to a Toyota Sienna and are happier with that. It has it's own share of problems, but nothing caused by engineering.

5th gen standard brakes are 305mm rotors, the HD rotors are 330mm.
4th gens are 282mm rotors.
But sure, they're the same size......

4th gen GC weighs in at just under 4100lbs.
5th gen GC weighs in at 4300 lbs.
So just over 200lbs in extra weight, but larger brakes to handle it.

 

[Sienile]

LOL, Good bull, even '08-10 3.8l exact same engines got ETC...\
...

On the '08-'10 engines, ETC isn't really necessary and cable throttle would still be fine. I'm pretty sure they knew the 3.6 was in R&D and would soon replace those engines, so they probably wanted to get the kinks out of the ETC system before it was necessary. Either that or they were just getting with the trend everyone else had already jumped on. ETC had existed for over 5 years at that point and the DGC was the last vehicle I know to switch to it.

But lets be real, no one really wants the 3.3, 3.8, or 4.0 5th gen Caravans. Why would anyone want an engine that makes less power and gets worse mileage? Only old people scared of change will be interested in those, which still doesn't bode well for the 4.0 being a 1 year old refresh of a less than decade old design.

One thing that is a benefit to ETC, regardless of what engine it's on, is it still works just the same with gutted mounts. I've seen quite a few cable throttles on vehicles with broken mounts and the cable, often where it exits the firewall, is broken leaving the cable exposed and unsupported in an area. This can be a safety issue that could cause the throttle to stick open. ETC will rotate to closed if the motor driving it fails, which is much safer in the majority of conditions.

 

[2019GTlife]

Growing up with the older technology and not working on much mechanically other than basic PM I must say that my 2019 DGC kinda scares me. One thing I have noticed is that things in general look to be better suited to being worked on without taking the whole van apart. Of course what goes wrong on mine will be the things that nightmares are made of or require a contortionist the do the work.
I reckon looks are in the eye of the beholder, I find that I like the 5th gen looks more than the others. I rented a Voyager a year and a half age and although it is a nice vehicle it is just to round and European styled for me. The best thing about a Voyager would be to block out the “oya” and have my very own Vger.
Something I have learned since joining this forum is that y’all that live a bit North of me have a tough time keeping things from rusting so I am sure the progression to newer vehicles happens much faster than down in my area. Another thing is that all gens of these vans have their problems and some are worse than others in each gen.
Can’t remember where I was going with all this so I will let it go,,,at least till I think of something else. 😀

 

[Road Ripper]

5th gen standard brakes are 305mm rotors, the HD rotors are 330mm.
4th gens are 282mm rotors.
But sure, they're the same size......

4th gen GC weighs in at just under 4100lbs.
5th gen GC weighs in at 4300 lbs.
So just over 200lbs in extra weight, but larger brakes to handle it.

Well gosh darn, they are. Still not much difference, 1/4" radius bigger. I know I compared a standard duty front rotor from a 5th gen to one of my old 4th gen front rotors and didn't see much of a difference. Same thickness too.

I also once checked the front caliper sizes, and those are the same too (comparing the all disk 4th gen brakes to 5th gen standard brakes).

Weights:
2004 T&C - 3,989 to 4,563 lbs. Note: heaviest vans were loaded AWD like mine.
2005 T&C - 3,989 to 4,331 lbs. Only FWD remain, thus the lower weight maximum.
2009 T&C - 4,336 to 4,621 lbs.

So yes, the 5th gens could be the same or heavier by 290 lbs. to 632 lbs. than a 4th gen.