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Intermittent no crank

749 Views 46 Replies 7 Participants Last post by  Phantman
My 2017 Grand Caravan with 24,000 miles has recently come up with a new glitch. When I turn they key FOB to start, the dash lights work normally but when turned all the way to start, the starter doesn't engage. Not even a click or a tick. If I hold it in that position for 4 or 5 seconds, sometimes it'll start normally. Sometimes it won't. And once most of the dashboard icons go out, I'm left with a bright red "BRAKE" and a round red flashing light next to it.
I talked to a mechanic on the phone and he says that usually means my key fob is not communicating with the keyhole lol! My other vehicles have normal keys so I know nothing about a key fob. But does that make sense? And does a key fob have a battery in it that needs to be changed? I forgot to ask the mechanic about that.
Today is Sunday and I'll call the dealer tomorrow but thought I'd ask here for a heads up to see if this is a frequent problem.
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Okay, didn't take long to find how to change the battery in a key fob. So I did that even though the original battery had almost the same voltage as a new one. And the van cranked up normally. But the problem is intermittent. So I'm not ready to declare the issue resolved. May not know for another week or even longer when the thing won't start and it throws up that BRAKE and flashing red light on the dashboard.
Sounds like you may have the same issue as this guy. Check and see if you have the same codes.
Mine is not showing any codes at the moment. It was in the dealer's shop last week because it wouldn't shift out of 1st gear and it was showing a code for that. But turned out to be a faulty transmission relay and a new replacement relay cured that problem. They did a complete diagnostic scan at that time and nothing else showed up. Also checked the battery and it is perfectly fine. I had hoped all that fiddling with the system would somehow cure this starting issue as well but... nope. It's still there.
I'm the other guy, lol.
My reading indicates that the blinking red light (immobilizer light) Is usually a problem with the key or the WIN module - Wireless Ignition Module- ( the keyhole lol)
The blinking immobilizer light is so I've been told almost always a problem with the key and the WIN communicating.
The fact that there were no codes on yours prior to the issue is good...but it's possible your issue arose after the last time you had it code scanned it's unclear in your posts exactly what the timeline is.
I know if I hook my Innova hand held code scanner up to mine it does not show my u1197 code but when the dealer does the scan it's there.
Good luck
I've had several electronic/computer glitches with this van ever since I bought it. And sounds like your reading lines up with what the mechanic on the phone was telling me about the no start issue.

I took the van on a week long vacation and was first stranded 300 miles from home with my gearshift locked in park as well as having this no start issue. Both of which I'd experienced before but not lately. I had already learned how to get the gear shift unlocked with the unlock button on the dash and I talked on the phone with the mechanic, right before AAA showed up. I had sometimes been able to resolve the no start issued by fiddling with fuses and relays under the hood. Basically wiggling and pushing and just making sure they were connected. Sometimes that would fix the stuck in first gear issue as well. And I was usually seeing codes. 882 I think was one and another in the 500's.


Anyhow, the first time I was stuck last week, I had already gotten the gearshift unlocked by the time AAA arrived. But before loading it on his truck, the driver and I both pulled and pushed every fuse and relay in the box. And by some miracle, the dang thing started and I was on my way. Later in the week, I had pulled into an Interstate rest area and shut down my engine for a minute. Then cranked up and pulled back out onto the Interstate and the stuck in 1st gear happened. I tried all the usual tricks that had sometimes worked in the past but nothing worked this time. So this time AAA loaded me up and carted me off to a dealer. They checked it all out and said the only problem they could find was the faulty transmission relay. So I was good for a few days until the no start issue reappeared (but no codes this time).


I finally made it back home last night though and I have two other more reliable vehicles to use, so I'm giving the van to the local dealer tomorrow to keep until the issue happens, so they can figure it out. I've cranked it up several times today though without a problem.


I think you're right though. This particular glitch sounds like either the Key fob or the WIN module. It's just hard to figure out an intermittent problem without just replacing parts willy nilly until the problem goes away. And even then you're never really sure it's fixed lol!
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It's just hard to figure out an intermittent problem without just replacing parts willy nilly until the problem goes away
Welcome to my world lol
If you haven't read through it yet you may want to read the thread I have currently going. A lot of the details sound very similar. I have been keeping it updates with any changes/updates.
It's possible it might be helpful.
Please come back and update your post with any details/changes/fixes that are applied to your issue, something that fixes yours could potentially be helpful with me in my misery or someone else having the same/similar problem lol
As far as I know, the battery in the fob has nothing to do with starting.
The fob has a transponder like all modern keys that is married to the vehicle.
The battery is only for fob remote functions.

I recently had my proximity fob and my backup fob both with dead batteries. Either one would start the van by inserting in the hole.

After putting new batteries I had to use each fob once in the hole before the remote functions would work.
But the proximity fob would allow the door to unlock when touching the handle, even though no other functions worked.

I know you can start it with your finger in the hole with a proximity fob inside.
Welcome to my world lol
If you haven't read through it yet you may want to read the thread I have currently going. A lot of the details sound very similar. I have been keeping it updates with any changes/updates.
It's possible it might be helpful.

Please come back and update your post with any details/changes/fixes that are applied to your issue, something that fixes yours could potentially be helpful with me in my misery or someone else having the same/similar problem lol
Yup, I read your thread and learned a lot. Some of the discussion is above my pay grade. I know just enough about electronics and computers to be dangerous. But I'll definitely update my thread as things work out.
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As far as I know, the battery in the fob has nothing to do with starting.
The fob has a transponder like all modern keys that is married to the vehicle.
The battery is only for fob remote functions.
Thanks for this info. That's all good to know. I'm a minimalist and have no use for a fob. Most of the time I leave mine in the vehicle. Usually in the ignition switch. I made a door key using the hidden key inside the fob as a pattern so I could keep it on my key ring. The fob is too fat and bulky to keep in my pocket. Plus my keys go with me overboard now and then. That key fob doesn't look very waterproof to me.
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New plan. I called my local dealer to let them know I was dropping off the van. They said my safest bet is to make an appointment. And their first opening is in June. Yes, JUNE! So now I'm shopping around for a local independent place. Meanwhile, I've been cranking it up now and then with no problem at all. If this keeps up, I just may be taking it on another trip next week. I'll be going right past the shop that replaced my transmission relay last week, only 600 miles from here. I don't have much hope if there's no codes and no symptoms. But that's the situation I find myself in.
I had roughly a two week wait before I could get mine into the dealership to have the new WIN module installed. Waiting sucks lol
Good luck, hopefully your issues are behind you.
If you continue to have issues, keep us informed
Just checked starting again. First try cranked it over but engine didn't start. That's never happened before. Second try cranked and started like it's supposed to.

I tried to reply to your post last night but after I'd typed in my reply, I wasn't able to post it until I gave them my email address (which they already have) and checked some boxes agreeing to accept a newsletter and that sort of thing. I didn't check those boxes so I assume that was the reason I wasn't allowed to post my reply. Is that sort of thing normal on this website??
Well.... it posted that time, no problem.
Just checked starting again. First try cranked it over but engine didn't start. That's never happened before. Second try cranked and started like it's supposed to.
A crank with no start could be a failing fuel pump relay. I have a diagnostic and fix guide in the stickies.
I tried to reply to your post last night but after I'd typed in my reply, I wasn't able to post it until I gave them my email address (which they already have) and checked some boxes agreeing to accept a newsletter and that sort of thing. I didn't check those boxes so I assume that was the reason I wasn't allowed to post my reply. Is that sort of thing normal on this website??
Newsletter? I've never seen such a thing. Only requirement to post is don't be a dick. :p
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Total guess here but I wonder if it’s possible the fuel relay is not responding correctly when key is turned so it’s withholding the start command to the starter? Might explain the intermittent issue.
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Nope. The fuel pump relay has nothing to do with the starter. The TIPM's internal circuit board seems most likely to me.
A crank with no start could be a failing fuel pump relay. I have a diagnostic and fix guide in the stickies.
Where might I find "the stickies"?
Newsletter? I've never seen such a thing. Only requirement to post is don't be a dick. :p
Making mental note to self <------
Do not be a dick
Do not be a dick
Do not be a dick

If this post looks the way I hope it will, it'll be a miracle. This my first try at interspersing a reply in the middle of a quote.
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Well I'll be dipped. It worked.
On top of every post page there is a navigation tree, the last option takes you to the main page for that generation. In this case:

Stickies have push pin icons beside them on that page. The Fuel Pump Relay sticky is currently the 5th one listed.
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