WD-40 is not even good for testing.My word ... what an argument ... this takes me back to about 55 years and school where I learned in Physics class about something called Stiction (aka Static Friction). It is the initial friction that stops two surfaces from sliding on each other until that friction is overcome. Then the normal dynamic friction will take over. Stiction is always higher than moving friction.
ANY FLUID film between the two surfaces will reduce the stiction. It's why figure skaters prefer softer ice.
That's what's happening with these bushings. The rubber bushing is stuck on the bolt sleeve until the torque overcomes the stiction. When the torque is greater than the stiction, with older bushings especially, the bolt moves suddenly and hence clunks.
Even a water film will reduce the stiction, but it doesn't last because the molecule size is too large. Oils will work better ... even the very little oils in WD-40 (although they leave the scene of the crime very quickly!)
Some bushings rely on the rubber to provide a cushioning where the rubber is designed to twist and take all of the movement. (I had some like this fail on my old Forester because some nutcase decided that the bushing should be vertical and would therefore collect snow and ice in the bushing web, breaking it as the ice expands! Others are there to provide a "softer" connection but allowing movement between one of the parts and the rubber. These mounts appear to be the latter.
So yes, WD40 is a good way to test these. It won't last though!
My 2c ... now to go hide!
All non-lubticated OE suspension parts are not tolerant to petroleum based lubricants, meaning that particular part will eventually get damaged by WD-40, period.Destroys it huh? Quite the generalization. It depends on the rubber compound, the amount used and the propellant etc. Many rubbers are affected by any hydrocarbon based oil but at the same time, many are not. Yes, there are other agents that will also work, but you need one that "creeps" ... this is one of the reasons that water is not particularly useful in this case ... it's molecular size is too large.
Fair point! Never did read much Poe.I just came here to say, if it really were a "telltale" sound, shouldn't you know what it is?
I'm not saying "USE GALLONS OF THE STUFF" which will go after the rubber, but a little bit for a test isn't going to have a huge impact, enough to destroy the thing ... and if you want, spray it with water and detergent! Sheesh!All non-lubticated OE suspension parts are not tolerant to petroleum based lubricants, meaning that particular part will eventually get damaged by WD-40, period.
If that specific part is already worn out, water, soap even oil will find it's way all the way through.
Jeepman, I just got from the Yukon, where I met Sargent Preston and his dog King, and I'll need a little time to catch my breath.
I was reading this thread because I have the exact same problem and have done the exact same things. But more interesting is that my mother-in-law actually married Dick Simmons, Sgt. Preston of the Yukon, when they were both in their 80's and had lost their spouses. They had been friends and neighbors for years.
Agreed. I have exactly the same problem coming from exactly the same area and have done exactly the same things you have except the struts; new sway bar bushings and links, new lower control arms and new tie rods all around. Had the clunk when I bought it a month ago and after all this it still does. As someone mentioned it does not seem like the kind of sound WD40 is going to have any effect on. We are talking major clunk here not just a squeak.Ok, so here's where I'm at:
Based on where I'm hearing the noise and feeling it, I'm really thinking it's not the sway bar bushings.
Has possibilities I guess. What is worth noting is as the original post mentions this only happens bad at slow speed ... less than 20 mph. Mostly from rocking back and forth not so much from hitting bumps. It does that too but mostly it's just the movement of the car that triggers it. The one that always works is to go out a driveway at an angle and get the car rocking. It's like there is something large that's loose and swinging back and forth hitting things. Probably not but that's how it feels. And it is severe enough to have a feel. We aren't talking just a small squeak or rattle here.Take a look at the cv shaft carrier bearing.
What's the brand and product # for your sway bar bushings.That said, while attempting to capture this video, I was in the passenger seat (I usually drive) and notice that I can feel the clunking coming from almost directly UNDERNEATH the passenger side footwell, which is making me think it may be the subframe bushings on that side.
Based on where I'm hearing the noise and feeling it, I'm really thinking it's not the sway bar bushings. But can I do the same test, as was recommended for the sway bar bushings? Seems like the same methodology may not work here.
This van doesn't use that part. That started with the Pacifica wagons and the 5th gen vans.Take a look at the cv shaft carrier bearing.
I'll check the bushing this afternoon. It was just a cheap knockoff. Maybe should have spent the extra $5 for the Moog ones. I torqued the subframe bushings (I assume you mean those two long bolts on the corners of the plate) to 120 lbs and they bushings looked to squish tight. I'll take a bar and see if I can move them. Thanks.What's the brand and product # for your sway bar bushings.
Unweight the link and you may find a bad one out of the box.
Check the large subframe bushing for tightness.
Moog Stabilizer Bushing Kit K7406What's the brand and product # for your sway bar bushings.
Unweight the link and you may find a bad one out of the box.
Check the large subframe bushing for tightness.
Most everyone seems to be convinced it's likely a sway bushing problem so I'll get some new good Moog ones today and stick them in. Easy job so why not. Interesting that for the first 10 minutes or so when I test drove it it didn't have the clunk and I figured I'd got it. Then it came right back.Metal, if the clamp is not clamping the new or old bushing properly, the bushing will stick/slip and creak.
I was thinking last night that a rubber strip glued to the underside of the clamp might add more clamping force to the clamp and prevent stick/slip of the bushing. I'd also make sure the sway bar, that is under the bushing, is clean.
That said, and unless the clamp is redesigned, I think it is a lost cause, as the bushings will creak and groan till the end of time!
In conclusion, I fixed mine, and the rest of you will have to wait till I get back from the Yukon.
Finally, Sgt. Preston wasn't even Canadian. He was from Minnesota, but maybe that is almost Canadian!
