[jnovickijr]

Michelins also have the softest sidewalls from what I have heard, that could be good or bad. I got 70k miles out of Dextero 2 tires on a Cherokee only rotated them once and only balance was beads. So much for you get what you pay for.

I agree with the above post about the load rating but would like to add that your individual driving style/habits will also have a great impact on the longevity of your tires. As will the roads you drive on. Is the road surface rough like tar and gravel or does it have the “traction grooves” in the surface? Are there lots of potholes that even if small can over time wear on a tire.

I don’t know who makes the best tires,,,I have not tried them all yet.


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Western PA is known for potholes and rough roads, which I've attributed to the increased wear, plus its usage as a family vehicle, with lots of stop and go trips (and hills). Just have never had a vehicle that runs through tires like this.

 

[jnovickijr]

Perfect alignment, not "perfect" alignment which is barely in spec; but actual perfect alignment with all the numbers dead center of the specified range. For me this required rear axle alignment shims, camber bolts, and a front subframe alignment after my ex's deer collision, in addition to replacement of the busted front suspension.

Yep, was there when they checked the alignment (after the transmission and axle replacement) and was definitely dead in the middle. I thought that part of the wear could have been attributed to a "shakey" transmission shift, but new tires are wearing the same with the new tranny.

 

[Long_Voyager94]

I'd love to have that problem. The last three Goodyear sets were all replaced under the mileage guarantee, and have tried Assurance ComfortTred, Assurance WeatherReady, to now the Assurance ComfortDrive. I swear I'm going with some Wrangler ATs next, because this is ridiculous.

Stop buying Goodyear crap and your problem will go away.

 

[Jeepman]

I'd love to have that problem. The last three Goodyear sets were all replaced under the mileage guarantee, and have tried Assurance ComfortTred, Assurance WeatherReady, to now the Assurance ComfortDrive. I swear I'm going with some Wrangler ATs next, because this is ridiculous.

Wearing out on the edges?

 

[04Quadcab]

Only things I can think of are that might explain the rapid wear:
1. you are an aggressive driver who accelerates hard, brakes hard at the last minute, takes corners near the limit of tire adhesion.
2. You drive on really rough surface roads that chew tires up.
3. You drive in heavy city traffic that requires constant braking/acceleration patterns that wear tires fast.
4. Tire pressure and/or wheel alignment are less than optimal.
For my part, I drive conservatively, which means easy acceleration, timing speed to catch the green light and generally avoid braking as much as possible, and cornering at reasonable speeds. 3 I have a pretty good amount of highway driving in the mix, which means less tire wear than city driving. Maybe your driving conditions are much different by necessity.
You might ask others in your area who have similar cars if they experience short tire life, i.e. is it you, your car, or unavoidable conditions that cause the problem.

 

[jnovickijr]

Wearing out on the edges?

No, surprisingly.

 

[jnovickijr]

Only things I can think of are that might explain the rapid wear:
1. you are an aggressive driver who accelerates hard, brakes hard at the last minute, takes corners near the limit of tire adhesion.
2. You drive on really rough surface roads that chew tires up.
3. You drive in heavy city traffic that requires constant braking/acceleration patterns that wear tires fast.
4. Tire pressure and/or wheel alignment are less than optimal.
For my part, I drive conservatively, which means easy acceleration, timing speed to catch the green light and generally avoid braking as much as possible, and cornering at reasonable speeds. 3 I have a pretty good amount of highway driving in the mix, which means less tire wear than city driving. Maybe your driving conditions are much different by necessity.
You might ask others in your area who have similar cars if they experience short tire life, i.e. is it you, your car, or unavoidable conditions that cause the problem.

Im sure of 2 and 3. Tar and chip is a friend of our state's DOT, and I swear they do every road every other year. Along with lots of parking lot maneuvers for school/activity dropoffs/pickups, I'm sure they play a role. I will be looking into the heavy duty tires, though, for my next set.

 

[gravitylover]

Keep pressure set at 37, even across the tread wear. I do have 102H rating now, but there isn't much higher available in the 225/65R17 OEM size. Even Tire Rack doesn't have more than 2 or 3 higher, and they definitely are made for trucks.

Look for 235/65/17 and you'll find more options. Check out brands Tire Rack doesn't carry like Nokian. I think the new Toyo Celsius also comes in a 104 or 106. I got the most recent set through Tire Agent on a great deal through Capital One Shopping, Priority Tire comes up with some good deals sometimes too.

 

[Jeepman]

All about the Continental True Contact Standard Touring All Season tire as a benchmark to work from:

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/continental-truecontact-tour

The internal construction of the TrueContact Tour utilizes a single ply, polyester casing. The low- to mid-apex balances handling performance and ride comfort, while dual steel belts are reinforced by a high-strength, spirally wound nylon overlay to enhance durability and high-speed uniformity.

 

[Gummy Bear Wagon]

I respectfully disagree. I've had a few sets of Michelins over the last 20 years and didn't appreciate any of them.

Michelin does offer a range of tires so I would be interested in which you had. We are not talking about Pilot Sports or the special fuel economy tire when we talk generalizations of their tires. I sure hope you were not buying the Michelin line-up from Walmart. Walmart is the only retailer I know of that sold Made in China tires from them.

Most LRR tires ride like garbage. The well-rounded Michelins can offer a nice ride and fuel economy. I would still avoid their Energy Saver.

I have seen a few bubbles in tires, and I think Michelin held more than its share, but bubbles are very rare.

 

[Jeepman]

Couldn't fault the OE Michelin Energy Savers on my 2016 for wear or wet/dry traction. Long wearing tires = hard tires. Then again, OE tides are tuned to the vehicle rather than for all vehicles.

 

[shuswap]

Lots of experience with the Mich Defenders on a variety of vehicles. I drive in a spirited manner and in all conditions, snow and extremely heavy rain and the Michelins cut better at freeway speed than anything else I've used, even when heavily worn. My van is an '05 and the front tires wear quite a bit faster on the outer edges, even with the pressures at 44psi. The rears actually last about 4 sets of fronts. I think this outer tire wear issue is an '05 Dodge thing because they wear more evenly on every other vehicle I've installed them on.

 

[Jeepman]

I had the original Defenders way back when. A slight skim of wet snow and they were like slicks. Scary tires, they were.

I see Tirerack has two Defenders listed and snow traction seems to vary accordingly.

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/surveyresults/surveydisplay.jsp?type=ST

I don't see their tread blocks being open enough to shed slush or get a bite in snow. Very seldom have I come across an all season tire that has open tread blocks for good snow bite.

 

[Long_Voyager94]

I had the original Defenders way back when. A slight skim of wet snow and they were like slicks. Scary tires, they were.

I see Tirerack has two Defenders listed and snow traction seems to vary accordingly.

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/surveyresults/surveydisplay.jsp?type=ST

I don't see their tread blocks being open enough to shed slush or get a bite in snow. Very seldom have I come across an all season tire that has open tread blocks for good snow bite.

Toyo Celsius CUV.

I have them on my Pacifica and they are better than some winter tires I've used in the past. They have 35k miles on them currently, still at 7/32 tread, hold the road wonderfully, and ride great.

 

[Jeepman]

That tire looks like it should get some bite in the snow and shed some slush. Impressive. Being an "all weather" tire it carries the “three-peak mountain snowflake” symbol.

More on the Toyo Celius CUV tire:

Long-Term Tire Test: Toyo Celsius All Weather Tires, Part Two

When we last checked in, we had put 4,000 km of mostly fair weather driving on the Toyo Celsius All Weather tires. As a fierce advocate for genuine winter tires, I admit I was skeptical of this new product. My opinions were based on facts gained by experience – from dozens of winter driving...

www.autotrader.ca

A tire worth considering and providing updates on.

 

[gravitylover]

Michelin does offer a range of tires so I would be interested in which you had. We are not talking about Pilot Sports or the special fuel economy tire when we talk generalizations of their tires. I sure hope you were not buying the Michelin line-up from Walmart.

I had them on 3 different cars as the OE tires. All three rode well enough and the tires seemed to wear reasonably well but the sidewalls were mush and the handling suffered because of it. I really don't like it when I can feel a tire roll over in hard cornering and I can see scrub marks an inch up from the tread. Maybe I'm weird but ride quality, treadwear and mpg are not as important as confidence in emergency maneuvering and the "giggle factor" of a car being laid into a corner and feeling like it's on rails. In the case of a top heavy minivan or suv a properly firm sidewall is even more important.

As to that Toyo Celsius pictured above, there's a reason I keep mentioning it. I've done the feel test on unmounted ones and done all the research to convince me that I want a set but for my most recent purchase I wanted something tougher rather than road oriented so I went with the Nokian Outpost APT. I may well get the Celsius for my wife's Volvo XC60 next week because that car never sees dirt or heavy loads and doesn't do 35k miles a year.

 

[04Quadcab]

When did the "all season" and "all weather" diferentiations come about? I only recently became aware there was a difference. To me, "all season" should include winter- I mean isn't winter a season?

 

[gravitylover]

The all weather category came about a few years ago as new rubber/silica compounds were able to be utilized more effectively. Better test data also led to new tread patterns so that these new compounds could work better in cold, wet, snowy and icy conditions. If I remember right, Nokian led the way and Dunlop followed right behind. Most winter specific tread patterns aren't very good in the rain and snow patterns aren't as good on ice as many people think but if you look at the newest stuff there are several different patterns all in one so the tire can perform reasonably well in a variety of conditions.

 

[Jeepman]

Yep, winter is a season, with or without severe winter weather. "All season" tires, like "synthetic" motor oil, are just illusions of what they really are. It's called marketing.

"All season" tires contain the M+S symbol that "summer tires" don't. Guess that makes them quasi winter season tires.

The "all weather tires" contain the Three-Peak Mountain Snowflake symbol. As I understand it, they are basically an all season tire compound/construction, with a little more cold weather flex (32F vs 45F), supporting an aggressive tread pattern that's more effective at gripping snow and shedding slush. There use to be the odd "all season" tire decades ago that did that - the old Canadian Tire MotoMaster SE tire of the 1990s, made by GoodYear, for example. It had very open tread blocks. Something like this but more open.

 

[gravitylover]

It's also the rubber compound and the amount of siping. Properly executed sipes give a tire more biting edges for better grip on ice and wet snow. If tread blocks are too open it throws all the snow which is NOT good. You want snow to pack into the linear grooves be cause there is more friction with snow on snow than air on snow, lateral grooves need to clear to expose the biting edges.