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Discussion Starter #1
This was an email to the NEVC (National Ethanol Vehicle Coalition):

Filler Er Up with E85!

Hello,

For the past 5 to 8 years, regardless of what kind of vehicle I am driving, I almost always fill up with E85. None of these vehicles were or are E85 equipped. I always start out with E10 and gradually add E85 into each tank, until I am all E85. Presently, I am running E85 in my 1992 Ford F 150 Pick Up Truck, 100,000 miles, 5.8 V8, and my non-E85 equipped, 2006 Dodge Gr. Caravan SXT, 10,000 miles, 3.8 V6.

I have heard all the stories, like your gas tank will rust through, your carbonator may blow up, blah, blah, blah.

I had a 1994 Dodge Grand Caravan, 3.3 V6, and I ran E85 from 50,000 miles to 138,000 miles, at which time I sold the van, only because it was getting rusty, and we needed a larger vehicle.

I would fill up with E85 even more often but there are only two or three stations in Lincoln, Nebraska that provide E85, making it a trip across town.

I thought I would pass this along. I have not had trouble, ever, with any vehicle and E85, (equipped for E85 or not equipped for E85).

Recently, I have switched to 100% synthetic motor oil, so basically, my cars are almost foreign oil free.

Thank you for all you do. Regards,
Andy Stebbing
Lincoln , NE

NEVC note: The NEVC does not endorse fueling a non-FFV with E85.
 

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Jason said:
This was an email to the NEVC (National Ethanol Vehicle Coalition):

Filler Er Up with E85!


I have heard all the stories, like your gas tank will rust through, your carbonator may blow up, blah, blah, blah.

NEVC note: The NEVC does not endorse fueling a non-FFV with E85.
Ooh, I hate it when my carbonator blows up!

What's a carbonator?

Why would the NEVC even publish this illiterate drivel?
 

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There has not been a 'carbonator' on a vehicle since the middle to late 80's.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
The last carbureted car engine (that I know of) is the Oldsmobile 307 V-8. It lived through 1990 with a carb. I think a Dodge/Jeep 318 or 360 lived on with a carb into 1990-1992.

The NEVC probably published it because it's enthusiasm about the subject, demonstrating how much some people really believe in their cause. That guy is more into it than I...as excited as I am about using it in the Grand Caravan, I won't be using it in the Cadillac.
 

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Geekier than thou
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I wonder what is included in an "official" E85 vehicle, compared to a non-E85 vehicle. What was different in my '99 and '02 minivans, which were E85 compatible, compared to my '06, which is not?
 

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The biggest thing is the computer and the sensor(s) which detect which fuel you're using. Not much else as really all cars are ethanol compatible now.
 

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Good question....

I would think elastomer material, injectors, and sensors could all be different. If not...maybe its just like a big placebo to attract higher sales dollars, and Mr. Stebbing is 3 steps ahead of us. :blink:

FYI: I'm currently rebuilding the (3) 'carbonators' on my outboard motor. Nothing like the smell of a 2 stroke in the morning :thumb:
No E85 allowed in that machine.
 

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AMD Rules said:
Good question....

I would think elastomer material, injectors, and sensors could all be different. If not...maybe its just like a big placebo to attract higher sales dollars, and Mr. Stebbing is 3 steps ahead of us. :blink:

FYI: I'm currently rebuilding the (3) 'carbonators' on my outboard motor. Nothing like the smell of a 2 stroke in the morning :thumb:
No E85 allowed in that machine.
Ever use Sea Foam fuel additive? It seems to do wonders for 2 strokes. It also does a great job in may van.
 

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Funny you should ask that. They just started selling it in Canada....been hunting for it a long time. I bought a can of Seafoam, and Deep Creep just this past weekend. Thanks for the heads-up though. :)
 

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AMD Rules said:
Funny you should ask that. They just started selling it in Canada....been hunting for it a long time. I bought a can of Seafoam, and Deep Creep just this past weekend. Thanks for the heads-up though. :)
I hope it works for you as well as it does for me...please let me know.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Yes, along with sensors and different computer software, many of the actual fuel system components are made with alcohol-compatible parts. I think I'd be smart to just build them ALL with E-85 compatible parts, even if they don't get around to changing the software for a few more years.
 

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I belive the injectors are a higher capacity injector as it takes a bit more fuel for the bang when using E85.
 

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I think I'd be smart to just build them ALL with E-85 compatible parts, even if they don't get around to changing the software for a few more years.
Saving a dollar totals up when counting the number of vehicles assembled by the number of injectors per vehicles. If they save a dollar per injector (and I believe it would be many dollars per injector) that would be atleast $6 per vehicle times how many hundred thousand vehicle comes to a few dollars saved. While I agree with you in principle, this is a business and you must build a product at the best quality and at the lowest cost to make a profit to STAY in business. We all want the moon but we must be realistic.

Yes, I am a retired auto worker and I will stand up for the industry when I can and when I need to. HOWEVER, I also have a business degree and I do understand the basics here and business is business. You gotta do what you gotta do. I am not saying "GO CHEAP". I am saying build the best at the cost they and you can afford.
I welcome any comments.
 

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Fuel systems on today's vehicles ARE all alcohol compatible. THe issue with E-85 is one of control. THere are diffrent and more sensors required, different programming (that has to be ok'd by the big bro EPA) for engine mgmt systems, etc. If you put E85 in a MODERN non E85 vehicle it will run VERY badly but odds are you will do no "damage" other than to your ego when your car has to be towed in.
 

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sellinghomes4u said:
Fuel systems on today's vehicles ARE all alcohol compatible. THe issue with E-85 is one of control. THere are diffrent and more sensors required, different programming (that has to be ok'd by the big bro EPA) for engine mgmt systems, etc. If you put E85 in a MODERN non E85 vehicle it will run VERY badly but odds are you will do no "damage" other than to your ego when your car has to be towed in.
Hola:
I wonder if DC will offer some "aftermarket" fix or option for it since at least in Mexico from next year on all of our gasolines will have at least some Ethanol on them, they are getting rid of additives like Bencene and other not enviromentaly friendly.
Saludos from VERY sunny Mexico (40 Celsius for today!):beerchug: Beertime!
 

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10% Ethanol blends are very common in the U.S. and I cannot think of a single incident of damage to a vehicle due to using the 10% blend.

Don't worry about the switch in Mexico, you'll be fine.
 

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We had the 10% alky stuff as far back as the 1970s here in the cornbelt. Used to run it through my '74 Gremlin X all the time. The higher octane actually allowed me to advance the timing a little, making an already snappy car that much quicker.

Of course, cars in those days weren't as "picky" as they are now.

I've been using the 10% stuff in the Spirits, Neons & minivans over the decades too with no ill effects.
 

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I have been partially filling up with E85 over the past month, in my 3.8L Town and Country. I fill up with gasoline (all gas now is at least 6% alcohol due to the end of using MTBE), then when the tank is 3/4 full, I add 5 gallons of E85. That puts my ethanol content at around 5 gallons out of 20, or about 25%. I have suffered no ill effects whatsoever and my fuel mileage is very similar--I normally average 20.0 mpg highway, and with the ethanol blended to 20%, I get around 18.8. If I'm feeling lucky, next time I'll up the blend to around 30% and see if this triggers the check engine light yet. I do have a theory as to why this works well in my van--my cold air intake causes the engine to want more fuel injected, so while this harms my fuel economy slightly on gasoline, it's just what the doctor ordered when using ethanol. Gasoline here in Michigan is $3.29 and E-85 is $2.74, so it works out to be almost equal in terms of miles per dollar (E85 contains 25% less energy but most tests only indicate a 20-22% drop in economy).
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I've read before that most non-E85 cars can actually take up to 25-30% ethanol, even though that's not what's available. One study showed ill effects coming on at about 27% E85.

But I'd be real cautious -- because you're not going to likely know the ill effects until some rubber o-rings degrade and you start spraying fuel onto your engine. :(

By the way, is your cold air intake really a cold air intake, or do you have a conical air filter in place of the air box?
 
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