[Rupert2]

Do most 5th gen GC expwrience fuel pump relay failure? More than 50%?

 

[Rupert2]

Is this failure of high probability? Would you recommend to carry the cable in the glove box?

 

[Viktimize]

Is this failure of high probability? Would you recommend to carry the cable in the glove box?

Probably closet to 100% than 50% they don't generally just completely die. It starts with rough starting for awhile. Or it'll fuse closed and run the pump non stop. The cable is cheap and easy enough to fab, can't hurt to carry it. But I wouldn't fret about it.

 

[Rupert2]

Thank you. I will be prepared. I have heard about fuel pump replacement and did one myself, but not the fuel pump relay. I guess I am driving one of a kind vehicle

 

[Sr22captain]

I’d like to buy the external relay kit Mopar part number CBWPR091AA. But every one online says it’s not available for external sale because it is a recall kit only. What are others here using to install the external relay?

 

[Sienile]

Any standard 4 or 5 pin relay will work. That's the main reason why I made this guide, to show people how it can be done with standard relays. Just make sure your wires go to the matching pin numbers in my diagram.

 

[Sr22captain]

Any standard 4 or 5 pin relay will work. That's the main reason why I made this guide, to show people how it can be done with standard relays. Just make sure your wires go to the matching pin numbers in my diagram.

It looked like the Chrysler kit had a relay holder that had mounting provisions to make it look like a “factory” install but I may be wrong. What relay holder did you use and how did you mount it?

 

[Sr22captain]

I see several on Amazon that have a metal tab with a screw hole so I could mount it to the tpm box.

 

[Sienile]

I got some relay holders from Amazon that had a metal bracket, likely similar to what you found. Bent the bracket to a 90 degree and used a push clip to secure it to the radiator support, like how they do in the TSB for the Durango. As an added bonus, I got clear relays from eBay that have a green LED that shines when powered, so I have a clear indication of if my fuel pump should be running. Those last much longer than the cheap black relays you will find on Amazon.

I would advise against drilling or screwing into the TIPM case. Would really suck to poke the board inside.

 

[Viktimize]

I see several on Amazon that have a metal tab with a screw hole so I could mount it to the tpm box.

The relays I bought from Amazon all came with mount tabs as well. I'd probably mount it to the inside of the fender wall like Dodge recommends it, before I tried drilling into the Tipm

 

[Rupert2]

Sienile,
I have a question. The external relay replaces the faulty internal relay. But the $59 plug-in unit does not have a relay. A fuel pump draws about 5A according to internet. The relay contact wears from each current interruption. Any relay-less approach would move this wear to another part in the circuit. Am I wrong? Is there a solid state (contact-less) switch built in the $59 plug-in?

I am not trying to find fault with the plug-in unit. To be honest, I am afraid of removing TIPM, multi-pin connectors, cutting tape wrap, taking a pin out, the whole thing. My instinct says not to do it. But if it is the right way, I have to. Is the external relay the right way?

A related question. Can I use a car relay with built-in resistor?

 

[Sienile]

Yes, the plug in system transfers the load to the Run/Start circuit. I'm also a bit leery about that. The F/P circuit is 20A while the R/S is 10A. I haven't heard of this causing any issues though. External relay runs a power wire directly from the battery and only uses the R/S circuit for triggering the relay, which is well within its power capability.

Why would you want a resistor in the circuit? All that will do is increase the load.

 

[Rupert2]

Then the external relay is the right way. We need to explain how the fuel pump relay works so that members can make an informed decision with the plug-in unit. I cannot recommend what I wouldn't do myself.

By the way, the resistor is built in the relay, parallel to the coil for spike suppression. I think the coil is about 100 ohms and the spike suppression resistor is >1000 ohms. Very common in cars. I am not an electrical person so just want to make sure.

3 relays, one with a resistor, one without, and one with a diode across the coil between 85 and 86

 

[Sr22captain]

the reverse diode across the coil is the right way to have a relay in the circuit. This is the way its done in electronics that can be very sensitive to spikes. Without out it, when you de-energize the relay, the magnetic field that the coil has created suddenly collapses and a backward flowing voltage spike is produced. The reverse diode now conducts and shorts the voltage. These are called snubber diodes.

 

[Rupert2]

Thank you for the explanation. I will use one with a diode.

 

[BigCee]

I ended up ordering the Vertical Visions bypass Lite version, and also a bypass cable on ebay. So I'll have a spare workaround in case the vertical visions one fails.

 

[Ray K]

2008 Dodge Grand Caravan 4.0 here. After a month of random crank-start-stall or crank-no start then start, I had the dealer keep it for a week and of course it started flawlessly for them cold or hot. Fortunately no charge. Talked to Jason at VV who said that the worst years are 2011-13 for GC so 2008 might have different/additional problems. Curious if others here with 2008-10 GCs used the VV lite or full version and resolved their startup issues.

 

[Sienile]

The TIPMs are functionally the same from '08-'20, so that or any of the other methods I posted would work. If you suspect other issues, I recommend using a bypass cable temporarily to see if that solves the problem.

 

[alambrose1]

I had this issue with a 2012 T&C. I bought a plug in module online, and that worked fine for many years.

Recently, I found an excellent YouTube video that showed how to disassemble the TIPM and remove/replace the faulty relay with a $10 replacement from Amazon... So I did that, and everything is working fine, and now I no longer need the plug-in module. Anybody wanna buy a plug in module? $99 bucks on eBay, I'll let it go for $25

 

[T&C2012]

After seeing a spike in people with no start issues, I figured it'd be best to do a simple write up on the fuel pump relay. (I also included a copy of the TSB for this issue on the Durango and a printable PDF of these instructions.) There are 3 ways to address the issue: the temporary bypass cable, an external relay, or one of the VV plug-in bypass modules. I only cover the bypass cable and the external relay. If you need help with the VV bypass, you probably shouldn't be driving in the first place.

The external relay is the recommended fix. It's cheap, permanent, safe, factory approved, and makes future issues much easier to deal with. I strongly advise soldering these connections. Not shown in my diagrams is the in-line fuse going to constant power - do not forget to include this.

The bypass cable should only be used as a temporary fix. It can leave the pump running when the engine is off and bad connections in the fuse box have caused fires.
View attachment 68197
Do not use the bypass cable as a permanent fix!

Here's the TIPM diagram with the external relay in place. There are 3 wires that you need to connect to. One of these you will leave the end going to the TIPM disconnected.
View attachment 68198
These are the connectors you will need to unplug to make the connections. The terminal numbers are in the color of the matching terminal on the standard relay. (Normally closed relay shown, but you should use a normally open relay.) You should verify the wire color before cutting into any wire.
View attachment 68199
The relay you use should be a normally open relay.
You should solder and heat shrink all connections for the best reliability.
You should have a fuse holder with a 20A fuse on the wire going to the TIPM B+ post.

Now for the bypass cable. Remember this is for testing and temporary use only.
View attachment 68200
The M7 slot has a keyed and a battery 12v output. Use this slot for testing only. It will leave the pump running when the engine is off.
The M37 slot is the same output the factory external relay repair uses and only has power when the engine is running or being started. Use this for an emergency bypass.
View attachment 68202
You can make a bypass cable out of 2 ATM fuse taps. They often come with a butt connector preinstalled on the wire. Remove it from one, strip the wire, and crimp it to the other.
The bottom fuse in the side going to the M25 fuel pump fuse must be empty to avoid backfeeding voltage to the Run/Start circuit.
When installing the bypass cable in M37 and M25, the wire side of the fuse tap will point toward the center of the TIPM. Installing it backwards in M37 may blow the 10A fuse. Installing backwards in M25 will not power the fuel pump.

Just got my little circuit board from Vertical Visions today, after using the ghetto cable to bypass the fuel pump relay, i always disconnected it to be sure. But now the VV board is installed in the TIPM/fuse box and the car works great! Great value for $59 plus shipping, to fix a faulty fuel pump relay.